Transformer less power supply

No, you guys all make one simple mistake. One end of the mains is grounded. This wiring implies that you've used a transformer. Search for ''Transformetless Power Supply 1''

No buggzy. Its just a place of a good 0V reference and has in this case nothing to do with earth ground as you always think its only possible. Ground has two different meanings, get that?

Yes an earth reference. But every mains in the world has one end referenced to ground and the other live. If this circuit is supposed to work with mains it cannot look like that.

Buggzy, for practical use and easy measurement it is the only way to place a ground/0V!!!!!!! And anyway nobody knows if this power system is earth grounded. You just guess it is. In many countries there is no earth ground in households. Also battery powered systems do not have a hard earth ground. Only maybe beside 0V a 50MOhm soft earth connection which has almost no impact.

Yes i assume that one end of the mains is grounded, because in every civilised country it is. I've never heard of a country with two lives. Care to give an example?

Two neutral pipo. In those countries you can touch both lines. Mostly wo any dangerous, if there is no ground contact. Which is sometimes the case (capacitive or by wet wires. Or the last transformer is bad isolated.

Okay i looked everywhere and i can't find such systems you describe. I found that sometimes in USA a central tapped 110-0-110V system is used to provide more power to heavy loads, but i didn't find such mains that is not grounded at one end. I don't get it :D

Its easy, if you travel sometimes. Count the numbers of wires you see at high voltage (high power) overland power lines. They are always dividable by 3! If not and you get a rest of 1 e.g. 7 / 3 are two 3phases systems (in depended) plus one flash protection, the upper most wire. Now think how or how not (as minimal configuration ) the power is coming into your household. Just with 3 phases no neutral and earth! And were in this chain is neutral/earth created!?

3 phase has ground, I've seen it on sockets. In my father's kind of work, w often use three phase electricity and there's always a ground. You won't see it on the power lines, because you don't need a separate wire for ground further increasing cost and complexity. Just stick a rod in the Earth somewhere and you got it.

Right, thats the trick, a long stick into "earth" and then call it "neutral" and forget earth. Thats what in many poor countries are done, because an extra (in parallel to neutral) wire for ground is waste of money and material! Got it?

In residential buildings, we often have only two wires, one being neutral with a ground connection somewhere in the building probably in the main distribution locker. The ground connection is common for all residents and the live is separate. I don't get why should the two be separated. It's very uncommon, not to say impossible, for the neutral wire to develop such a high voltage, that to be shock hazardous in respect to ground. Furthermore isn't it safer to reference the neutral to ground, so that it'll always be at same potential as ground. It doesn't make it any less safer to connect ground to neutral, but you have to size the conductor so that if any short circuit occurs it may carry the current safely until the breaker switches. So as you see it's either a separate wire, or a thicker wire, not much of a difference.

Sure, earth is an extra wire and is at least as thick as neutral, better a little more. In developed countries outlets have all three connections - live, neutral ( created from ground at house entry) and earth - earth is the first which must have get contact to a device while plug into outlet and it must be the last while remove plug. Its not allowed to switch earth its always hard wired internal. Only live and neutral are switched for power on and off. Its also separated to neutral to be better protected against a mechanical break. Now attention this might be complicated to understand: Suppose you drive a 10Ohm device (heater...) At one live and drive a 1kOhm device (radio) at another live! Both gets 230V, but what will happen if neutral breaks for some reasons at house input???? I make it short, both devices are suddenly in series at two different lives and see about 400V!! The heater dont care the radio might burn. More important both devices wouldn't have any ground protection, if its used from neutral! You see it makes sense to have an extra wire and connection to devices!

Yes if neutral breaks at house input, the wire is still connected to ground in most cases. Anyway how can there be two different lives. I mean there are separate lives, but if they're single phase the potential difference will be not 400V but 0V, so probably no current will flow. At least that's how we get supplied, only a single phase live, and multiple neutrals that connect to a central point somewhere in the building where they are connected to ground.

We have three different lives in most households three-phase each in phase 120° shifted in voltage. Each 230V 50Hz to ground and phase to phase 230V*√3= ~400V or peak 563V! The phases are splitted one for light. One for wall plug's. One or two for oven... 3x16 or 20A. This is in all "developed" countries standard!

No, for us 3 phase supply is a rarity. You will NEVER find such a supply in residential buildings, rarely in rural areas. Mostly in factories and such. There is usually no need for such supply in normal household appliances. I do get what you mean and i agree, but it's rare to see such supplies.

Rare in Bulgaria! But common in Germany. Only small households e.g. student flat without hotwater heater do have a single 16A supply and a smaller oven if any.

Yes we usually put a different fuse for such appliances. Most household outlets are now rated at 40A, where they were only 20A 30 years ago

Back to groundless supply. Most equipment I have outside Germany, in countries with 110,115,120V supply which needs 220,230V is powered by two phases and does not need any earth ground connection nor neutral! There are houses which are completely powered this way working on 220V or more precise 207.8V

Typically yes, but here in Europe, we only use single phase, even with heaters and ovens, because at 220V it requires less current to drive such loads, than at 110V. For instance driving a 5kW load at 220V requires 22A, which ia normal for any household built after 1980, even a 10kW load is feasible with some precautions, but driving a 5kW load at 110V would mean 45A which is just too much for the wiring to handle let alone 10kW. Three phase is rarely used in Bulgaria and mostly for industrial purposes (motors, high power electrical saws and such). In Europe where the voltage is 220-230V we NEVER use such two phase systems you describe, because we don't need such. In America, maybe, even surely, but not un Europe. Anyway won't such two phase systems also require a grounded central tap of some sort for safety reasons

"But here in Europe, we only use single phase"? Isn't Germany central Europe? Oven 10kW, washing machine 4kW, dryer 4kW, microwave and hot water in kitchen 3kW, light 500W, wall outlets 1kW. And this is an example for a small household maybe 2 or 3 persons. In sum 22.5kW plus a headroom to not burn the house +20% we endup by 25kW minimum power or 110A at 230V. For this you need 3phases no way on a single one! Thats Europe!

No, I'm sure that it is single phase only, here in Bulgaria. In my village house, we used three phase yes, because the installation was new, but then something happened and we had to switch to single phase. My father's is still driving with ease a 10kW central heating system and a bunch more heavy loads. At peak levels we draw more than 25kW and a single phase handles it with ease. I should mention that we're only 25meters from the central distribution system, so maybe we can draw such powers because there is not many losses from it to us, idk