EveryCircuit

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Was?

hurz

8 years ago

Was?

ViolationMad

8 years ago

@hurz Ich wollt dir den Transformator verkaufen...Aber erst wenn ich weiß woher ich den hab.

hurz

8 years ago

Ich fürchte, den will ich so nicht mal geschenkt haben.

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Und wie mach ich dann n richtigen Leckerbissen draus?

zorgrian

8 years ago

Sei gut für die Umwelt. Kaufen Sie diesen Fantasie Transformator von einem virtuellen Trödelladen.

hurz

8 years ago

Zusammen addiert haben jetzt etwa 80H Ausgangsimpedance. Je nach Frequenz mit der der ZVS dann läuft, wird hinten kaum was heraus kommen. 80H x 6.283 x f = Xl

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Wie kommst du auf die 80H? Du sagst ja impedanz und ich kenne die nur mit Ohm als einheit. Aber dann könnte man die ja nicht in die fromel für den Induktiven Blindwiederstand einsetzen oder? Und ist der Kondensator nicht auch noch wichtig für die Ausgangsimpedanz oder ist das dann mehr die sek. Seite?

zorgrian

8 years ago

Be careful not to start up a big argument at this point

zorgrian

8 years ago

Der Krieg wurde wegen weniger Meinungsverschiedenheiten angezettelt.

hurz

8 years ago

Ausgang ist die Sekundär seite. Auch der Blindwiderstand wird in Ohm angegeben, ist allerdings wie ich schon sagte von der Frequenz abhängig. 80H kommen über den quadratischen Zusammenhang der Windungszahl und dessen Verhältnis. Hier 1000:5=200 dies ins Quadrat macht 40000 das heisst die Sekundär Seite ist 40000 mal höher als die primär Seite, die Du mit 1mH gewählt hast. Das macht dann 40000*1mH=40H da zwei gestapelt sind kommen wir dann auf 80H. Wenn der ZVS mit 10kHz läuft, dann bekommen wir 10kHz*6.283*80H=5MegaOhm, wie du siehst wieder Ohm. Klar das sind Blind Ohm also anders zu behandeln als die DC Ohm gemessen mit Gleichstrom. Aber es sind Ohm und deshalb redet man auch gerne von 80Henry Impedance.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Result: do not argue with @hurz as mostly he is right!

zorgrian

8 years ago

I just wanted to use the German word 'Meinungsverschiedenheiten'

zorgrian

8 years ago

Mainly because its the longest German word I can remember.

zorgrian

8 years ago

But @hurz will know much greater longer German words...

ViolationMad

8 years ago

@hurz Danke für die Antwort. Soll ich dann die sek. Windungszahl verringern oder die prim. Iduktivität. Ich weiß halt nicht was realistisch wäre für die Induktivität.

hurz

8 years ago

Ok, das beantwortet dann meine erste Frage, der Transformator ist eine Erfindung. Egal. Ja, die Ratio muss kleiner werden oder die primäre impedanz. Dann wird er realistischer. Zorg ist da ein wenig neben der Spur 😉

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Achso ja ich hab die Schaltung ohne Trafo gefunden und den dann einfach schnell irgendwie ohne nachzudenken dazu gemacht.

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Aber mir war eh nicht so klar auf was man da alles zu achten hat.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Yes i am mostly beside the real point here... However, I am not against multilingual electronic development

zorgrian

8 years ago

Which I have been trying to promote

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Sí patrón, i love the idea to make information avaible to everyone. Das macht es aber nicht einfach. Come con l'italian?. Je nais se pas.

hurz

8 years ago

Ja, Transformatoren haben es in sich und dennoch, wenn man weiss was man will bekommt man sie ganz gut in den Griff für die Simulation und ihr Model.

hurz

8 years ago

Zorg, dont worry, we do have just a simple discussion about transformers nothing dangerous

zorgrian

8 years ago

Im not too worried about transformed transformation. EC is easier in some ways than spice. However, it is not as precise.

zorgrian

8 years ago

también, podríamos intentar usar el castellano?

zorgrian

8 years ago

Wir müssen die geistige Impedanz auf den mehrsprachigen Austausch von Ideen reduzieren. Nein?

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Ja ist wahrscheinlich doch besser 😅

hurz

8 years ago

Und, schon Nägel zum Glühen gebracht?

zorgrian

8 years ago

Ist es besser, zum Neandertaler-Denken zurückzukehren?

hurz

8 years ago

Your translator seems to be more a monkey!

ViolationMad

8 years ago

@hurz Erstne Frage mit den Nägeln?

hurz

8 years ago

Nee, sorry war ja nur Hochspannung und nicht Hochstrom.

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Achso ich bin mir nur nicht immer sicher ob du das ironisch oder so meinst. Haha hab ich aber alles schonmal gemacht mit MOT's und so.

hurz

8 years ago

Nee, war einfach nur eine einfache ehrliche Antwort

ViolationMad

8 years ago

Na dann perfekt, wie gesagt hab ich aber tatsächlich schonmal versucht.

zorgrian

8 years ago

No one had anything negative to say when first I mentioned this idea, but now people are coming out of the woodwork to criticize it.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Are your 'nails' like things coming out of the woodwork? If so, how many amps are needed to light up such nails?

zorgrian

8 years ago

I do agree that the translator, is probably a monkey

hurz

8 years ago

Its not a question of amps directly applied to nails. The idea is to apply a magnetic field which inducts eddy current and this indirect current heats up the nail. For a reverse engineering it is interessting to measure the direct current you need to heatup nails to then calculate how strong the magnetic field must be. But this is another thread.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Its a shame we cannot induce thinking into some EC users minds using a supercooled magnet and pulses. Such technology may evolve from MRI scanning machinery. However, for now this is science fiction.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Also, I would be careful with the nails near a powerful supercooled magnet.

hurz

8 years ago

We humans are quite tolerant against magnetic fields even they are 1000 times stronger then the earth magnetic field.

zorgrian

8 years ago

The interference between pulses in an MRI scanner raises the temperature of the slice being scanned by 80°C. Basically, this microwaves the brain. Especially when it is the brain that is being scanned. The pulses have extremely fast edges. Thus high energy!

zorgrian

8 years ago

So its not the magnetic field that is dangerous. No! It is the electromagnetic energy focused directly at living material that is in danger.

hurz

8 years ago

But what is its frequency?

zorgrian

8 years ago

There are a whole range of microwave frequencies produced as a sum and difference between the pulses. Often a frequency sweep of pulses is done. However, these sweeps may be down in the kHz range. Its not this that raises temperature, its the high energy fast edges of the pulses.

zorgrian

8 years ago

MRI is invasive! But less invasive than CAT scanning (which is usually rubbish quality) or opening the brain to have a look!

maxmax_66

8 years ago

@zorgrian. Most standards relate to a gradient increase in core body temperature of 0.5 degrees Celsius in the normal operating mode. Patient supervision is required for a first level controlled mode allowing for a gradient increase of 1 degree Celsius. Not sure where you get an 80 degree gradient value, but it seems absurdly high.

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

True. Might as well use a microwave cooker.

hurz

8 years ago

Maxmax_66, wow, were is this body temperature from? Looks extremly LOW!

zorgrian

8 years ago

@MaxThump2000, I suppose you have worked with MRI scanners, so which make, serial number? Please provide strength of magnet and details of 'normal' scan pulse sequence...

maxmax_66

8 years ago

What change in core body temperature do you expect?

zorgrian

8 years ago

RK-wad, yes, that is the point I'm making, well done Mr brainpower. Very clever! The MRI is not going to cook your pork chops very well, so I recommend when you need a scan yes, why not stick your head in the microwave oven...

maxmax_66

8 years ago

@zorgrian. Is the sarcasm really necessary? If you have a point to make, make it.

zorgrian

8 years ago

@MaxiPants666, Its late, you are full of bullshit, you piss me of completely, you have no idea what you are talking about and you are a total waste of time

zorgrian

8 years ago

Where do you dredge your bullshit crap from? I assume you have some knowledge that would be worthy of contradiction of my experience with MRI scanning equipment, but of course you do not!

zorgrian

8 years ago

No sarcastic intention now @maxhead666

maxmax_66

8 years ago

More conjecture. Try an aluminum foil hat. I've heard it keeps out those pesky government control waves.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Bring it! MaxWarpBullshit666

zorgrian

8 years ago

Benga!

maxmax_66

8 years ago

Ah, did I hurt your feelings, Princess?

zorgrian

8 years ago

@MaxPaxMontreal please supply evidence

zorgrian

8 years ago

@PaxFuck, where is your pea brain evidence for your shitwaffle? Hmm?

maxmax_66

8 years ago

The upper limit for localized heating is 40 degrees C (requiring special approval) Where do you get this bullshit 80 degree C gradient?

zorgrian

8 years ago

Oh I see @ShitMaxiPax666, core temperature... Did I mention core temperature? No! No i did not because its meaningless. Homeostasis of most mammals will regulate what I believe you refer to as 'core' temperature. No, no no, MaxShit666 I refer to raised temperature of the 'slice' which is being scanned. Thus we are talking about focused energy in one place. This is especially true with MRI brain scans @MaxShitHead

zorgrian

8 years ago

Where do you get your shit from

zorgrian

8 years ago

I get my knowledge from working with MRI

zorgrian

8 years ago

@MiniMax666, WTF? Special approval? We do brain scans... Yes we have to have special approval.

zorgrian

8 years ago

@BluntMaxHead666, a full brain scan can last for a 45 minute duration. Sometimes longer. Please do not just issue random bullshit dredged crap from a children's encyclopedia

maxmax_66

8 years ago

I'll wait until you've calmed down a bit. It's like arguing with a toddler on a tantrum. Bye.

maxmax_66

8 years ago

Note that an 80 degree C positive gradient would bring the sampled tissues well beyond the boiling point of water. Does this seem reasonable for an MRI scan of any duration?

zorgrian

8 years ago

@MaxToxic666, It is a miracle! Finally, you are starting to see the actual danger here. Good @MaxToxic666, your last textual output is within psychometric boundaries for rudimentary converse.

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

Again I see convergence between @hurz and @zorgrian. There is no need for this arrogant, vile-tempered, child-like ranting. And, you talk about intelligence & knowledge - both in complete absence here.

zorgrian

8 years ago

As a toddler, I am very impressed!

zorgrian

8 years ago

Whereas as a man in his 50s, I am not so impressed. @PaxWaxMax666

zorgrian

8 years ago

@KiddyRobby, next why not take up a claim to be a 10-12 year old? Or, perhaps thump your fist hard upon sacred texts in absolute ignorance?

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

Are you ageist? It matters not. I’m sure Eisenstein was brilliant as a boy. However, it is not only children that can behave child-like as you have clearly demonstrated. Nuff said.

zorgrian

8 years ago

I do not say that behavior of children is a problem; it is an advantage. I am concerned over a trend in claims of being a child when in reality, the claimant is obviously not, or at least possess no apparent child like quality.

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

Who are these that are not young but claim to be?

zorgrian

8 years ago

I have no direct evidence, since it is impossible to know. However, equally there are those here who make claims of juvenile status yet appear to be quite the opposite. Indications include: use of language, lack of any humor whatsoever, highly exceptional design, advanced knowledge of electronics etc. I accept that this is speculation, yet it seems probable that there exist those who wish to seem rather more exceptional than they might be in reality.

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

OK. Thanks for a no-nonsense answer.

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

I don’t agree that being old goes hand in hand with a lack of humour though:-).

zorgrian

8 years ago

OK you may have a point, and of course it does not. However, imagine a situation where we are not discussing a relatively normal person, but instead a pretender to claims of artificial juvenile status?

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

You are describing a person or persons who might feel they have inferior knowledge for their real age, so pretend they are younger such that people may think they are clever, intelligent, knowledgeable etc. for their stated age. Can’t understand why anyone would bother - but I accept a person might.

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

That would be a sad person in my view.

zorgrian

8 years ago

I agree, but it does seem the none of us are perfect, myself included

hurz

8 years ago

Only robbi is perfect!

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

Many a true word was spoken in jest!

zorgrian

8 years ago

At least the jester could contradict the king at the risk of loosing his head.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Then, there is the headless jester, who carries no risk at the cost of eternal silence!

Robert_Kidd

8 years ago

He would lose his head, not loose it.

zorgrian

8 years ago

Yes the subtlety of translation is often lost in the art of perception

hurz

8 years ago

@maxmax_66, protein is getting stuck at 41°C absolut, so what you are and Zorg talking about heat above that level in gradiants (40+36=76 or even 80+36=116)? Strange discussion...

maxmax_66

8 years ago

My point exactly. Any claim that an MRI scan raises localized temperatures (most particularly the brain) beyond 40 deg C is pure conspiratorial nonsense.

hurz

8 years ago

I have absolut no experience in this field, but its interesting. Does time somehow matters and how close todays equipment does heat to 40°C to get best results, cause I guees more energy means better pictures? How many cells are killed with a single scan?

maxmax_66

8 years ago

Under normal scanning conditions there would be little to no heating of the tissues. For an extended scan duration the heating of tissues can be mitigated by alternate pulse sequences, but even under these circumstances, the positive gradient would rarely exceed 1 deg C. Beyond the incredible soft tissue imaging abilities of MRI technology, it leaves all cells intact and undamaged.

hurz

8 years ago

I remember the assistance gives a warning before they start a scan, it might get warm or even a "hot" feeling at some body regions. But this "hot" is probably not the real temperature, could it be also missleading signals from nerves?

zorgrian

8 years ago

Sorry, none of my statements are designed to be misleading. The 'time', here meaning for how long is the energy that causes heat presented to any 'localized position' within the brain is necessarily of great importance. Here we are discussing very small amounts of time. However, it is the accumulated effect of the mixing of very high energy pulses needed to produce most types of brain scan that is of potential concern. We have moved from the position of looking at MRI as zero invasive to acceptably low degree of invasive exploration. The higher strength of magnets used together with faster rise/ fall times of pulses does result in heating. It is nearly useless to use the term 'gradient' here when such a gradient remains undefined! FULL MRI scans of the brain do carry risk. This is offset by the undeniable benefit of obtaining large amounts of information. An example is being able to produce an MRI angiogram without the use of contrast. This allows rapid assessment of strokes and other blood supply problems within the brain. In this context, it is easy to say that MRI scanning is definitely minimally invasive, when compared to any other exploration method. The caveat here is that yes the high energy involved does heat the brain and 80° is a reasonable approximation of the heat rise given that the rise in temperature is over a very short duration, the normal argument has been that this does not present any risk. This view point is changing.

carlos2201

8 years ago

PURE SHIT THIS CIRCUIT